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	<title>Comments on: Mongolia Explodes</title>
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		<title>By: yan</title>
		<link>http://registan.net/index.php/2008/07/08/mongolia-explodes/comment-page-1/#comment-377484</link>
		<dc:creator>yan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:33:29 +0000</pubDate>
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http://asiangypsy.blogspot.com , http://jaspal.typepad.com , http://altanzam.blogspot.com</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>links:<br />
<a href="http://asiangypsy.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://asiangypsy.blogspot.com</a> , <a href="http://jaspal.typepad.com" rel="nofollow">http://jaspal.typepad.com</a> , <a href="http://altanzam.blogspot.com" rel="nofollow">http://altanzam.blogspot.com</a></p>
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		<title>By: yan</title>
		<link>http://registan.net/index.php/2008/07/08/mongolia-explodes/comment-page-1/#comment-377483</link>
		<dc:creator>yan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 11 Jul 2008 13:31:59 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Camel Racer: The riots were on July 1st, two days after the election, and AFAIK a normal working day.

Maybe it would be fair to add that allegations of vote rigging are not really new to Mongolia, the same happened in 2004, just back then it was from the other party.

The state of emergency has expired, btw, all media outlets seem to be operating as usual again.

asiangypsy.blogspot.com , jaspal.typepad.com , altanzam.blogspot.com and probably some others have a much more complete roundup of the situation. Some comments from the head of one private station (and accused of fuelling the situation, foreign meddling etc.) can be found at http://www.thomasterry.com/blog/ .</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Camel Racer: The riots were on July 1st, two days after the election, and AFAIK a normal working day.</p>
<p>Maybe it would be fair to add that allegations of vote rigging are not really new to Mongolia, the same happened in 2004, just back then it was from the other party.</p>
<p>The state of emergency has expired, btw, all media outlets seem to be operating as usual again.</p>
<p>asiangypsy.blogspot.com , jaspal.typepad.com , altanzam.blogspot.com and probably some others have a much more complete roundup of the situation. Some comments from the head of one private station (and accused of fuelling the situation, foreign meddling etc.) can be found at <a href="http://www.thomasterry.com/blog/" rel="nofollow">http://www.thomasterry.com/blog/</a> .</p>
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		<title>By: Camel Racer</title>
		<link>http://registan.net/index.php/2008/07/08/mongolia-explodes/comment-page-1/#comment-377462</link>
		<dc:creator>Camel Racer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 22:23:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Ann, your friend seems to assume that the rioters were citizen activists protesting the machinations of the MPRP, as if the Democrats were innocents. They were not. One of the wonderful things about Mongolia is that political affiliations are relatively fluid, and relatively transparent (as was the recent election, according to all international observers). Remember that the protesters originally came from the Democratic headquarters, unfortunately on the same block as that of the MPRP, to confront the Prime Minister, and the situation quickly turned ugly. There are a plethora of youtube and other internet clips from the riots. From all the evidence, it appears that the crowd was too large, too drunk, and too charged, and the private security guards protecting the MPRP headquarters too few in number. Election day, as a holiday, unfortunately lends itself to overindulgence, something many of the protesters were a part of, according to the BBC, AFP, AP, UPI, and the NYT, as well as numerous Mongolian news sources. 

As the night unfolded, more and more frustrated young men descended on the square, with vodka and combustibles. In blacking out all but the state media, the authorities sought to remove the temptation from any more would be rioters. This was successful, and the ban has subsequently been lifted

This was not &quot;a disappointed crowd,&quot; nor was it peaceful. Mongolia&#039;s democracy is still the most vibrant in the region, something its people can be proud of. Is it perfect? Of course not, but this was not a manifestation of any widespread dissatisfaction with the state of Mongolian democracy. Rather, it was a breakdown in crowd control. Shops were not looted for necessities, but for alcohol, and the attacks on the museum and the theater point to a riot, not a protest. Your friend seems to be echoing the party line of some members of the Democratic Union who have gone into hiding in fear of being charged with incitement. While one appreciates the frustration with which DU supporters may feel as a result of their recent loss, wanton property damage and assault are not the proper way to express this.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ann, your friend seems to assume that the rioters were citizen activists protesting the machinations of the MPRP, as if the Democrats were innocents. They were not. One of the wonderful things about Mongolia is that political affiliations are relatively fluid, and relatively transparent (as was the recent election, according to all international observers). Remember that the protesters originally came from the Democratic headquarters, unfortunately on the same block as that of the MPRP, to confront the Prime Minister, and the situation quickly turned ugly. There are a plethora of youtube and other internet clips from the riots. From all the evidence, it appears that the crowd was too large, too drunk, and too charged, and the private security guards protecting the MPRP headquarters too few in number. Election day, as a holiday, unfortunately lends itself to overindulgence, something many of the protesters were a part of, according to the BBC, AFP, AP, UPI, and the NYT, as well as numerous Mongolian news sources. </p>
<p>As the night unfolded, more and more frustrated young men descended on the square, with vodka and combustibles. In blacking out all but the state media, the authorities sought to remove the temptation from any more would be rioters. This was successful, and the ban has subsequently been lifted</p>
<p>This was not &#8220;a disappointed crowd,&#8221; nor was it peaceful. Mongolia&#8217;s democracy is still the most vibrant in the region, something its people can be proud of. Is it perfect? Of course not, but this was not a manifestation of any widespread dissatisfaction with the state of Mongolian democracy. Rather, it was a breakdown in crowd control. Shops were not looted for necessities, but for alcohol, and the attacks on the museum and the theater point to a riot, not a protest. Your friend seems to be echoing the party line of some members of the Democratic Union who have gone into hiding in fear of being charged with incitement. While one appreciates the frustration with which DU supporters may feel as a result of their recent loss, wanton property damage and assault are not the proper way to express this.</p>
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		<title>By: Ann</title>
		<link>http://registan.net/index.php/2008/07/08/mongolia-explodes/comment-page-1/#comment-377459</link>
		<dc:creator>Ann</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 Jul 2008 12:32:52 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>In the context of your suggestion that &quot;one of the instigators of the violence was Democratic Union leader Tsakhiagiin Elbegdorj,&quot; you might be interested to read the following message that I received on July 2 from Muren, in Hovsgul Province, from a good friend of mine...

Here in Muren, on July 1, 2008, I and my father were watching three TV channels reporting what was happening in front of the MPRP building. Till 3pm, the big demonstration was peaceful but frustrated. We were discussing that the demonstrators were like any disappointed crowd who just saw an unfair wrestling game. Then we started seeing the policemen dragging few people out of the demonstrators and started beating. This didn&#039;t fuel mass disorder yet. We also started seeing a police officer pushing policemen close to the crowd and yelling &quot;Go ahead&quot;. Before we realized what was all about, the crowd started fighting back to police. All of the sudden, the peaceful crowd seemed to be a dangerous one.  
whatever happened after-- fire and shooting, and state of emergency etc.--you probably know by now.
What is interesting to me now is that there are so much human rights violation going on in UB, according to reports I am receiving from UlaanBaatar. This is just a short list:

1. No press freedom anymore. All TVs except the Mongolian national TV is closed.

2. Highest censorship in Mongolian national TV-- the TV and Radio Board decided to follow orders from the State of Emergency schtab. This means that few government officials are deciding what to show and not show on the only available TV.

3. Reporters are closing their cell-phones. People wanting to report about human rights violations and their problems are calling me asking whom to address about their disappeared children and family members.

4. Young people, teenagers are being arrested on UB street massively yesterday--July 2. According to call made from nearby Denjiin Myangiin detention area, there are around 700 young men and teenagers are under arrest. Few mothers called to say that their sons were arrested outside their homes. Mothers demanding their children back were beaten by police today morning, another source tells.

5. A source reported that policemen were bragging in street that they beat many young people until &#039;the red light came out of their butts &#039; and how &#039;happy&#039; they felt about this opportunity to beat &#039;fat and thin boys&#039;.

6. National TV is not reporting the demonstrators&#039; side of the story. The TV reporters call them &quot;riots&quot;.

7. According to a source, arrested young men and teenagers are being tortured to sign a false testimonies. It is suspected that they are either ordered to sign against themselves or against a concrete political leaders. There is no access to arrested people by their parents and all questioning process is going on without attorneys.

My friend speaks Mongolian.  It is unlikely that any international observers, unless they understood this impenetrable language, had more than the slightest idea what was going on before (when, I have heard, there was widespread buying of votes by MPRP candidates), during and after the election beyond what they could see, as distinct from what they could hear.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In the context of your suggestion that &#8220;one of the instigators of the violence was Democratic Union leader Tsakhiagiin Elbegdorj,&#8221; you might be interested to read the following message that I received on July 2 from Muren, in Hovsgul Province, from a good friend of mine&#8230;</p>
<p>Here in Muren, on July 1, 2008, I and my father were watching three TV channels reporting what was happening in front of the MPRP building. Till 3pm, the big demonstration was peaceful but frustrated. We were discussing that the demonstrators were like any disappointed crowd who just saw an unfair wrestling game. Then we started seeing the policemen dragging few people out of the demonstrators and started beating. This didn&#8217;t fuel mass disorder yet. We also started seeing a police officer pushing policemen close to the crowd and yelling &#8220;Go ahead&#8221;. Before we realized what was all about, the crowd started fighting back to police. All of the sudden, the peaceful crowd seemed to be a dangerous one.<br />
whatever happened after&#8211; fire and shooting, and state of emergency etc.&#8211;you probably know by now.<br />
What is interesting to me now is that there are so much human rights violation going on in UB, according to reports I am receiving from UlaanBaatar. This is just a short list:</p>
<p>1. No press freedom anymore. All TVs except the Mongolian national TV is closed.</p>
<p>2. Highest censorship in Mongolian national TV&#8211; the TV and Radio Board decided to follow orders from the State of Emergency schtab. This means that few government officials are deciding what to show and not show on the only available TV.</p>
<p>3. Reporters are closing their cell-phones. People wanting to report about human rights violations and their problems are calling me asking whom to address about their disappeared children and family members.</p>
<p>4. Young people, teenagers are being arrested on UB street massively yesterday&#8211;July 2. According to call made from nearby Denjiin Myangiin detention area, there are around 700 young men and teenagers are under arrest. Few mothers called to say that their sons were arrested outside their homes. Mothers demanding their children back were beaten by police today morning, another source tells.</p>
<p>5. A source reported that policemen were bragging in street that they beat many young people until &#8216;the red light came out of their butts &#8216; and how &#8216;happy&#8217; they felt about this opportunity to beat &#8216;fat and thin boys&#8217;.</p>
<p>6. National TV is not reporting the demonstrators&#8217; side of the story. The TV reporters call them &#8220;riots&#8221;.</p>
<p>7. According to a source, arrested young men and teenagers are being tortured to sign a false testimonies. It is suspected that they are either ordered to sign against themselves or against a concrete political leaders. There is no access to arrested people by their parents and all questioning process is going on without attorneys.</p>
<p>My friend speaks Mongolian.  It is unlikely that any international observers, unless they understood this impenetrable language, had more than the slightest idea what was going on before (when, I have heard, there was widespread buying of votes by MPRP candidates), during and after the election beyond what they could see, as distinct from what they could hear.</p>
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